No Bookmarks Exist.
Hello everyone and welcome to today's BE NRC meeting. 00:00:00
Before we start the meeting, I have a couple of announcements. 00:00:03
We have received the resignation of our former chair. 00:00:06
Megan McKenna. 00:00:10
And with our vice chair, Susan Myers, out of town. 00:00:12
We have our secretary. 00:00:16
Rebecca Lee. 00:00:17
As Chair Pro Tem for today's meeting. 00:00:19
Per the Pacific Grove Boards, Committees and Commissions Handbook. 00:00:22
Vice Chair Susan Myers will elevate to chair for the duration of the term or the calendar year. 00:00:26
And. 00:00:32
At the next meeting meeting, we can expect an agenda item to elect a new vice chair. 00:00:33
So with that, I'll hand it off to. 00:00:40
Chair Pro Tem Rebecca Lee, thank you. 00:00:42
Ohh, it's. 00:00:56
Different There's no red light. Alright, good afternoon, everyone. I'm very excited to be here. This may be the only meeting I 00:00:58
chair in my entire life, so I'm going to enjoy it. 00:01:02
It's with great regret that we received the resignation of Chair McKenna. 00:01:07
She was an extremely bright, intelligent person intellectually and a bright spirit and she'll be missed and I completely 00:01:12
understand and support her decision. 00:01:18
Just to be with more of her family and I hope when her children get a little older, she'll come back to us. 00:01:23
Umm. 00:01:32
So I guess we need a roll call. 00:01:36
If you could call the meeting to order, please. And sorry, I meant to do that. 00:01:38
I'd like to call the meeting to order and now ask for A roll call. 00:01:43
Commissioner Brisson. 00:01:48
Here. 00:01:50
Commissioner walking stick. 00:01:51
Present. 00:01:52
Secretary Lee. 00:01:54
Present. 00:01:55
Commissioner Dunn. 00:01:56
Present. 00:01:57
Commissioner Tibbs is absent. 00:01:59
Commissioner Susan Myers is absent. 00:02:01
OK. 00:02:06
I guess I'm still secretary, so I'll get the. 00:02:08
No tough the minute unless. 00:02:10
OK. 00:02:12
I mean off the video. Thank you. I appreciate that. OK, are there. We'd like. We need to approve the agenda now. 00:02:13
Someone make a motion please. 00:02:21
I approve. We approve. I I move, We approve the agenda. 00:02:23
A second. 00:02:27
All in favor, aye. 00:02:29
Any opposed? 00:02:31
No. 00:02:33
OK. And then now we're moving on to staff and. 00:02:34
Commission. 00:02:38
Announcements. 00:02:39
OK, I'll start. 00:02:42
The USDA Forest Service. 00:02:45
Has. 00:02:47
Umm. 00:02:48
A branch called the Urban Forest Connections and they're doing a webinar series, and they are inviting experts to share the latest 00:02:50
science, practice and policy on urban and community forestry. 00:02:56
And this series is every other month. 00:03:03
The second Wednesday from 10:00 AM to 11:15. 00:03:06
Pacific Standard Time. 00:03:09
And the last one was September 13th and it was entitled Innovative. 00:03:11
Approaches for. 00:03:15
Establishing trees in harsh. 00:03:17
Urban environments. 00:03:20
So these are really like top notch scientific. 00:03:21
Latest everything and I encourage anyone interested to watch them. 00:03:27
Umm. 00:03:32
And I don't know, George, can I? 00:03:36
What I'd like to do is in reviewing for this meeting. 00:03:38
I reread the the NRC duties and policies and it said we are to meet every other month or more more. 00:03:42
Frequently than every other month. 00:03:51
I mean every month. 00:03:53
And so that means essentially we can't miss a meeting since we're already meeting monthly. 00:03:54
And so I'd like to agendize permanently. 00:03:59
Subcommittee Reports. 00:04:02
So we always have an agenda item and always have a a reason to meet and is that an appropriate thing to announce or does that need 00:04:04
to be agendized? How does that work? 00:04:09
Secretary, I think you're welcome to announce that, and I think a further discussion will be required, and a further discussion 00:04:17
would require it to be put on an agenda for a future meeting. 00:04:22
OK. 00:04:27
All right. Thank you. 00:04:28
Anybody else? 00:04:29
I just want to announce that on September 9th, George Washington Park had a very successful leading effort. 00:04:33
Somewhere around 20 people showed up, Donuts and coffee were had and we had a large swath of. 00:04:41
The corner of pine and Alder removed of some of our invasive grasses, ready for some planting that we're heading towards here in 00:04:49
the next month or so. I'd also like to announce that on September 30th, which is not this Saturday but the next, we will have 00:04:56
another wedding event and I'm looking to get that. 00:05:04
Poster out and available for people. 00:05:12
I think we are starting our doughnuts and coffee around 8:30 and then a little presentation about forest health. 00:05:15
And fire mitigation at this next agenda, next meeting event. 00:05:23
And then we'll start reading at 9:00 until somewhere around noon. So come join us. 00:05:29
Thank you. 00:05:33
And just as a follow up, that weeding is so important to remove those grasses, that is what allows. 00:05:35
The trees to recede naturally and grow our forest back. 00:05:41
OK is. 00:05:46
You know, council member? 00:05:48
Colletti on Zoom with us. 00:05:50
Ohh. I'm sorry. Please go ahead. 00:05:56
Just a general announcement. Thank you to the city and the public who were so cooperative during an elephant seal rescue that we 00:05:59
had at Lovers Point Beach at the beginning of the month. 00:06:04
That was really just great to see. It's such a busy spot. 00:06:10
Also Monarch Sanctuary subcommittee. 00:06:15
Update George Florist and I attended A Pollinator workshop at the museum. 00:06:19
And Commissioner Walkingstick George Forrest and I will be working with the museum this month on. 00:06:25
Community outreach for the sanctuary. 00:06:33
Great. Is Councilmember Coletti available for announcement? 00:06:39
Secretary Lee, I do not believe so. I do not see him online. OK then we don't have any liaison announcements. So we're moving on 00:06:44
to general public comment real quickly from the staff make a quick announcement. George, first environmental program manager, just 00:06:50
want to announce that the last week of September is stormwater Awareness Week. 00:06:56
And Pacific Grove has been working with its. 00:07:03
Collaborative partners as part of the Monterey Regional Stormwater Management Program. 00:07:05
To plan some training events, we're going to be sending our building officials and public works staff to participate. 00:07:10
And concurrently, we're also working with the National Marine Sanctuary to. 00:07:16
To. 00:07:22
Chemical, you know, water sampling of outfalls along the coast in line with that are with the Mono regional stormwater management. 00:07:24
Program. 00:07:31
Requirements. 00:07:33
So I just wanted to announce that. 00:07:34
Be aware Stormwater Awareness Week. 00:07:35
Will that meeting be all week or just one day? 00:07:39
There are trainings throughout the week, but there's an in person training that is hosted in Monterey. 00:07:43
That specifically for building officials. 00:07:50
That is just one day. 00:07:53
But there are training opportunities. 00:07:54
Not locally in person, in other parts of the state, and available locally. 00:07:56
For anyone. 00:08:02
OK, excellent. And then how will this be? 00:08:03
Released to the public or or or How will that information be utilized in our city? 00:08:08
So it's mostly geared towards professionals and to building officials who have all been that's been communicated to them. 00:08:14
If anyone is interested. 00:08:21
A lot of information or all the information is available online at Monterey C. 00:08:22
And that's. 00:08:27
SEA. 00:08:28 and that is the kind of outreach website for the. 00:08:29
Monterey Regional Stormwater Management Program. 00:08:35
OK. Monterey OK, thank you. That sounds really exciting. 00:08:37
And excuse me, George, I'm the lackey here is secretary. You said you were monitoring the storm drain runoff With which 00:08:42
organization, but the National Marine Sanctuary? 00:08:48
Thank you. 00:08:54
Right now we'll move on to general public comments. 00:08:58
So if you have any. 00:09:01
General public comment, please come to the podium. 00:09:04
Hello. 00:09:16
I think I'm on. 00:09:17
Yes. 00:09:18
My name is Peggy Gibbs. I'm a Pacific Grove resident. I just even though Christine already said this, I wanted to say thank you. 00:09:20
To all the volunteers that came out for George Washington Park. 00:09:26
And ask the question, maybe you can all address how we can best get the word out so that there's even more. 00:09:30
Thank you. 00:09:37
Go ahead, Carmelita. 00:09:55
Or are you waiting for photos? OK, good. So I'm Carmelita, and I'm here to give you a. 00:09:56
Update of the red season that is ended and is now beginning the new one. 00:10:01
So just briefly, Rudd is a term used to describe behavior of deer during the breeding season, and the word is derived from a Latin 00:10:06
word called. 00:10:12
Pronounce Reguera. 00:10:18
So that's what what means. Just FYI so. 00:10:20
Do I control this or what? 00:10:25
You could just request next slide. OK, next slide. 00:10:26
So it's here, writing season. 00:10:30
The buck stays with the dough between three and five days. Fawns are born six months later, mid June. 00:10:34
And during this past reading season, we did see the birth of a A fawn on May 19th, 2023. And then this other slide here of these 00:10:41
other two funds, they're a little older. 00:10:46
So they were born well before April. 00:10:53
You can tell by their size and what have you which. 00:10:56
Leads us to believe, and we do believe, that reading season last time happened a lot earlier than typical. 00:10:59
Next slide So these photographs are very unique and wonderful to have. They were taken by. 00:11:06
Josh. 00:11:13
This is the first light, or actually $2.00 actually writing and and this was during August. 00:11:14
And then the other two slides show the worn part of the antler, which is a direct result of the racks cooking together and 00:11:20
fighting. This is what the buck do when they're vying for a particular dough next slide. 00:11:26
And so currently, this is a list of some running behavior that's been observed. Pico Ave. Grove, there was a buck and a doe. 00:11:33
Carmel Ave. This was pretty cute. Someone actually videotaped this on Facebook. One book after four dough. 00:11:42
And then recently Forest Ave. a buck crossing the street. And this is unique because. 00:11:48
There's a herd between 6:00 and 8:00 Doe that reside at the Pacific Grove Middle School area, So. 00:11:54
No doubt that's where he was headed. Next slide. 00:12:01
This is a herd of $8 that were located at the Point Pinos Lighthouse. 00:12:06
And you can see they're young because they still have the velvet on their rack next slide. 00:12:11
And then this is a slide of 11, but very mature and if you look close enough. 00:12:19
You can see that the velvet is totally gone. 00:12:24
This was really interesting to me because it demonstrates we have two big herds here in Pacific Grove now. 00:12:27
Next slide. 00:12:33
These are our statistics and the bottom line is that. 00:12:35
The population doubled between the last writing season and this reading season. 00:12:40
Next slide. 00:12:45
And this is where they were pretty much observed. 00:12:47
Mainly at the golf course, cemetery, the beach track, the Middle school, Forest Grove School, Pacific Adult Adult School and 00:12:50
George Washington Park. 00:12:54
And it was reported, and I make this point of dough in her twins at the Monarch sanctuary. 00:12:58
So as the city and staff proceed with their plans to go in and do what they're going to do. 00:13:04
You know, we ask that you be very. 00:13:10
Aware that this dough and the siblings will come back again for the next breeding season because they are seasonal. 00:13:14
And I just want to thank everybody who helped to collect this data. 00:13:23
And for the photographs? 00:13:27
Is that it? 00:13:30
Thank you so much. 00:13:31
Good afternoon. Good to see everybody. My name is Mike Gibbs, my PG resident and member of the Economic Development Commission. 00:13:48
And I too was at the cleanup on that Saturday. And thank you for the Maple Old Fashioned Donuts. Those are really great. 00:13:55
And I did have a couple of slides the the focus is more on the general. 00:14:03
The plan that the City Council considered here, the 1999 plan, that 2022 plan, and that we live on Alder, just South of just north 00:14:08
of Short St. and this is the entrance at that corner of Short and Alder. This is kind of what it looks like now. 00:14:16
Up next please. 00:14:25
So these slide these pictures are actually the left one is 2017. 00:14:28
And the one on the right was taken last week at the same location and you can it's kind of hard to see but if you look at on the 00:14:33
left hand slide. 00:14:37
That property in the background is on older 249. 00:14:42
And I tried to stay in the same place to get this same perspective as this little girl here, this granddaughter here. I couldn't 00:14:45
quite get in there because of the poison oak, but it's kind of the same. 00:14:50
Saying what I want to show here is the condition of the park. 00:14:54
And the ability of children and to use the park and people to walk their dogs through the park. 00:14:58
So you can kind of see here the difference between those two years. 00:15:04
Thank you. 00:15:07
Next slide. 00:15:08
Looks like this. 00:15:12
Ohh this is sorry, same thing. 00:15:14
The again 2017 walk through the park that has been cured and and taken care of. 00:15:17
And then the one on the right is, you know, the current condition of the park, taking last week from roughly the same position, 00:15:22
again looking E toward Altar. 00:15:26
Next please. 00:15:30
So I think everybody understands this. This is the same location at 2:45 older. 00:15:33
Where the big tree fell down December 30th or something. 00:15:38
It fell across the power lines, almost hit the guy had moved his car, would hit his car. 00:15:41
And these trees were this is taken this morning. 00:15:46
And I think that the. 00:15:50
The PUC code says. 00:15:53
8 feet up and 10 feet out. And clearly this is not the situation here. These are four Transformers. 00:15:55
The three on the left you can see in the one on the right you can see is they are not to what code would expect. In their my 00:16:01
opinion they're dangerous. 00:16:05
Because a lot of these trees are right under the power lines and under the Transformers. 00:16:09
Next please. 00:16:14
So on the current board and batten of the Historical Society is a picture of. 00:16:16
Emily. 00:16:22
Williams. 00:16:23
She was an early Pacific Grove architecture partner. Life partner was Lillian Palmer, a great metal worker and artist. 00:16:24
And she built a house. This is on the right. This is at 243 Alder about. 00:16:30
Just a little bit north of where the tree fell. 00:16:35
And it's a very small home she built in 19/06/1907. 00:16:37
We have a house that's about the same age as this. 00:16:41
Just a little bit down the street, but at this house here there's a young woman in a wheelchair. 00:16:45
And there's a wheelchair ramp. 00:16:49
And if there was a fire, I just wonder, could she get out in time? 00:16:51
Because she's it's it's a very difficult angle for them to get out and then through the fence she lives there, it's a rental with 00:16:55
her mom. 00:16:58
So we want to, you know, and be shamed. There are 6 houses on Chestnut and Elder that are Emily Williams homes. One has been torn 00:17:01
down so there's five left. 00:17:06
Next please. 00:17:10
So if you could wrap it up please. 00:17:12
What's that? Respectfully, we're wrapping up. I think we just want to make it safe for kids to walk her dogs through the park. 00:17:15
That's my objective. We showed up to clean up. We'll be there in September on the 30th. And I appreciate what you're doing. Thank 00:17:19
you very much. 00:17:23
Sorry, sorry to. 00:17:28
By Rebecca congratulations. Nice to see you in a position of authority for the first time. I know some of you are good people, so 00:17:37
thank you. And the rest of you, I don't know, you're probably good people too. Anyway, Vince Tuminello, Pacific Grove resident. 00:17:42
And I want to support what Mike Gibbs had to show you. And I've walked through the park and just four or five times a week for the 00:17:48
last 30 years. 00:17:53
It's one of my walking routes. I go down Gibson, get into the park. Sometimes I go down to Short St. and get in down there by more 00:17:58
Fisher's old house. 00:18:02
And walk through the park and I've seen a lot of neglect and I think those photos he showed show that. 00:18:06
OK. Also, since I can talk about anything that has to relate to Pacific Grove, I want to. 00:18:12
Point out to you that we have a community of about 15,000 people. We've got a pretty well established footprint. We have parks, 00:18:17
ball fields, schools, shopping centers, homes, so on and so forth. Well, do you, are you aware and to what extent are you aware 00:18:24
that the state of California is pushing a mandate on all the cities, communities and Pacific Grove municipalities? 00:18:32
To build additional housing units. 00:18:39
And to tell you how this works, Carmel is A1 square mile Town. They want them. They're mandating that they have. 00:18:43
356 new units. 00:18:49
Now this can be garage convergent conversions that would count if everybody converted their garage. 00:18:53
Into a studio, we would have the number, but you know, everybody's not going to do that. 00:18:58
Or you can. People are going to have to build units in their backyards and their solid side yards. 00:19:02
So on and so forth. Maybe tear a few homes down, or a fire will destroy some and they can build some apartment buildings. 00:19:08
And that would, you know, help out the number. 00:19:14
But mainly, Pacific Grove is a charter city. 00:19:17
And a charter city is very rare. We're one of the few charter cities in the state. That means we have special authorities. The 00:19:21
state has limitations as what they can push on us. 00:19:25
And think about this. 00:19:30
If Pacific Grove doesn't comply with the state mandate fully. 00:19:32
Not at all, but fully. 00:19:37
We have to build 11150 some odd units that would be either all garage conversions into studios or in new individual units. 00:19:39
You could do that with your little garage, make it a little studio and there you go. That would be 1 unit. However, think about 00:19:50
this. The state can also force us to use Parklands. 00:19:54
For housing development, ohh. 00:20:00
George Washington Park is perfect. 00:20:02
You got the North End, you got the South end. Let's take half the park, cut down all the trees and we'll build apartment buildings 00:20:04
there. And they have the power to do that under the mandate that exists right now. If the City of Pacific Grove doesn't comply 00:20:09
100%. 00:20:14
With. 00:20:19
What they expect us to do in the next seven years, Right now they're working on a plan. So I wanna let you know there's an 00:20:20
organization that's two approaches. Our Our is a group that's opposing this. 00:20:27
And also there's Because specific roles are Charter City, we're sending representatives to Sacramento with other charter cities to 00:20:34
hopefully let the state know you can't push us around because I don't want to see school yards, parking lots and parks be used for 00:20:40
housing development. 00:20:45
Thank you very much and you should be aware of that. Thank you so much. 00:20:52
Thank you. 00:20:55
Is there anyone online? 00:20:59
Yes, we have a hand raised from Lisa Gianni. 00:21:02
Thank you. I really appreciate Carmelita's presentation on the deer. 00:21:07
And I hope she'll keep. 00:21:15
Keep doing that on a fairly regular basis because it's it's really great. 00:21:17
And to learn what's going. 00:21:22
On out there, beyond just the area I'm I'm used to walking. 00:21:25
And and I appreciate the data that's being collected and and what we may be able to. 00:21:32
Learn from it. I also wanted to say that I. 00:21:38
I appreciate Rebecca's. 00:21:43
Suggestion that I hope will be agendas next time for for having. 00:21:47
The subcommittee reports. 00:21:54
At each meeting, to the extent that you. 00:21:57
Ready and and and want to do it. 00:22:00
Because we're. 00:22:04
We're all interested. 00:22:06
In in what you're doing, and this has been such an energetic group. 00:22:07
And and it I I hope it will be. 00:22:12
The motivating or. 00:22:18
I can't think of the word that I want to use, but anyway rewarding for you to be able to share what where what you're doing. 00:22:20
That's what I wanted to say and. 00:22:25
Yes. 00:22:31
We. 00:22:33
I know we'll all miss. 00:22:34
Megan. 00:22:37
Um, Megan's leadership and participation. I hope she'll continue to. 00:22:38
Participate when she can as a member of the public. 00:22:43
But I totally totally understand. I don't know how. Anybody. 00:22:47
Has a job in children and and and. 00:22:51
Chairs both this. 00:22:54
Commit be NRC the Commission and and also participates in the. 00:22:58
Climate Action Committee as well. I think that's it. Thank you so much for all you're doing. 00:23:04
We also have a hand raised from Inga, Lawrence and Dahmer. 00:23:16
Thank you. 00:23:20
Yes, it's great to see you up there, Rebecca and your. 00:23:22
Queen for the day. 00:23:26
And Carmelita, I do want to thank you for your great little slideshow. 00:23:28
I miss seeing all the writing and stuff on my street on Slow Ave. that used to have it before three more homes went up. 00:23:34
And. 00:23:44
Now it's, you know, we get maybe an injured one or the ones hunkering down. 00:23:46
Next to me with the fawns, you know, but I don't see all the. 00:23:52
Magnificent bucks. Quite, although my yard shows that deer there every night in the front. 00:23:57
Anyway, thank you for your work on that. 00:24:04
And I also want to say. 00:24:07
That you had two really great letters in your general. 00:24:10
Public comment written that has a link on your agenda and I hope you Commissioners are really reading them and. 00:24:15
Taking them to heart, so to speak. 00:24:26
And. 00:24:29
Yes, and I like the fact that the suggestion of agenda using the subcommittees too, because it's very necessary. 00:24:32
To keep that going and to keep the meetings going and to keep all of you. 00:24:41
Which you're doing such a good job, very active in this whole. 00:24:47
Situation of. 00:24:51
Revamping, should I say public works a bit? 00:24:55
Anyway, thank you very much. 00:25:00
No further hands raised. 00:25:05
OK, great. Thank you, everyone. 00:25:07
We now need to. 00:25:10
Move to approve the minutes and there I'm sure are some corrections. I know of 1. 00:25:12
I need to learn to spell Dominic Cynic Robbies. 00:25:18
Name and I will do so. 00:25:21
Are there others? 00:25:23
I had a couple. 00:25:27
Kathy Wooten's name. 00:25:29
Is spelled. 00:25:31
I'll give it to you. 00:25:33
And. 00:25:35
Weiss, why should have an apostrophe in the in the first in Section 4 under? 00:25:38
Public comments. 00:25:44
Why should be? 00:25:46
Possessive. 00:25:48
Umm. 00:25:49
I'll ask you later, There was another section I was unclear about. 00:25:53
And. 00:25:57
Section 9. 00:25:58
With this. 00:26:00
Correspondent. 00:26:01
Lane Layne noted that. 00:26:03
To get it right. I wasn't sure what that meant. 00:26:07
And then one more thing. 00:26:11
Are you still speaking to me? 00:26:12
I noticed in two situations it said that. 00:26:16
Umm. 00:26:20
There were. 00:26:21
Motions that were passed 6 to 0 and there were only five people here, I think since I was absent. 00:26:23
So I would just amend. 00:26:33
The 60 It happened twice to five, but you were the only absence, yes? 00:26:35
So 7 -, 1 is 6. 00:26:40
Was Susan OK? I thought. 00:26:45
OK. I'm sorry. 00:26:48
Claudia walked in late. 00:26:50
OK. That's it. Sorry. Thank you. 00:26:52
OK. 00:26:54
Thank you. 00:26:54
So I can move to approve the minutes with the aforementioned. 00:26:58
Modifications. 00:27:03
I second. 00:27:07
All in favor. 00:27:08
Aye. Any opposed? 00:27:10
Motion carries 40. 00:27:14
With. 00:27:17
Too absent. 00:27:18
Commission members. 00:27:19
OK, great. 00:27:20
So now we're moving on to our regular agenda, and the first on the agenda is item 7A, which is considering a donation from Nader 00:27:21
Aga if the stained glass butterfly. 00:27:27
Peace. 00:27:34
And I understand there's a presentation on that, but. 00:27:35
I'd like to welcome you up. 00:27:39
Or if you could give me a moment to pull up the presentation and I'll run through these slides from the staff perspective and Mr. 00:27:41
Aga is here and is also. 00:27:46
Is not here, sorry. 00:27:51
As Mr. Aga is represented represented today by. 00:27:52
Susan Goldbeck. 00:27:56
And I'll give a quick presentation and then. 00:27:57
Open the floor for her and. 00:28:02
I believe she's available for questions also. 00:28:04
OK. Thank you, George. 00:28:07
Understood. Thank you. 00:28:13
Secretary Lee and Commission members, what we have today for consideration is a art donation proposal. 00:28:32
This is for a large stained glass. 00:28:39
Piece titled The Butterflies. 00:28:42
And the potential donor is Nadir Aga and the Aga family. 00:28:44
I'm going to start off with the picture that I pulled from an old Herald article on Hellman's building, but it's kind of gives a 00:28:50
glimpse at. 00:28:55
The original location of this piece. 00:28:59
The kind of front facade. 00:29:01
This three panel. 00:29:03
8 foot by 12 foot stained glass window and now I'm going to move on to photos provided by the. 00:29:05
Potential donor and the proposal. 00:29:11
Believe this is a view from inside the building. 00:29:15
And a close up view featuring the monarch butterflies fluttering over the ocean. 00:29:19
Another photo provided. 00:29:27
And so just some facts here. This was previously installed at the Homeland building. It's 8 feet by 12 feet. 00:29:31
The proposal includes the donor covering the cost of installation and construction. 00:29:38
That would be with a cement footing. 00:29:42
And a protective barrier. Further details of that are included in the attached proposal. 00:29:44
In the original proposal, certain modifications. 00:29:50
Were requested. 00:29:54
And those modifications. 00:29:56
Kind of go contrary to Council Policy 900-3. 00:29:59
On the city's kind of terms for accepting our donations, but city staff has discussed this with the potential donor. 00:30:04
And some of the conditions. 00:30:12
Agreement with them on what they would be willing to kind of compromise their. 00:30:16
So one of those conditions was that originally they had requested that the piece would remain installed on display and not be sold 00:30:21
or transferred to the city, and instead would be returned to the Auga family if that was to be the case. 00:30:27
And they're agreeable to the that condition being agreed to for a period of 10 years, after which. 00:30:33
It would be a. 00:30:39
Unconditionally in the hands of the city. 00:30:40
To kind of handle as as they see fit. 00:30:43
And then the other thing that was discussed was the location. 00:30:46
Originally they had proposed. 00:30:51
As pictured here, the location on the left. 00:30:53
This is in between the Police Department and City Hall on Forest Ave. 00:30:56
So this picture this is a snap from there. 00:31:01
Proposal. 00:31:05
And the. 00:31:06
Architects rendering I believe. 00:31:08
Showing the location and that building that you see there, that kind of monolith. 00:31:09
Is the generator house. 00:31:13
That whenever the power goes out, kicks on and powers the Police Department, the fire department, City Hall. 00:31:15
And. 00:31:21
One of the issues. 00:31:22
Is that there's currently a tree right there. So and then another issue is just the proximity to the generator house. You know, 00:31:24
when that thing is firing, it's also vibrating, it's putting out some emissions. And the public works had some worries that any 00:31:30
future work needed at the generator house would become more difficult if this was put. 00:31:36
Right up in front of it. 00:31:42
And so there's alternate location. 00:31:44
Was proposed and the potential donors are agreeable to this alternate location just across. 00:31:46
The driveway lower down on. 00:31:51
Forest there. 00:31:54
There, that and that's a view. 00:31:56
From Google Street Street Maps. 00:31:58
Showing the. 00:32:00
Currently proposed location. 00:32:02
So per policy 900-3. 00:32:06
Artistic outdoor art acceptance. The BRC will. 00:32:10
Use the art acceptance form attached to this agenda. 00:32:13
As a basis for evaluating the art proposed for donation and making a recommendation to City Council, who will who shall make the 00:32:17
final determination on whether the city will accept or decline the proposed donation. 00:32:22
Ohh Miss. Susan Goldback is here representing the potential donors. 00:32:29
Sure. 00:32:34
I'm here not only as a representative of the Aga family and Navaga. 00:32:44
But as a citizen, I just think the Butterfly Town having this in front of their Civic Center would be awesome. 00:32:48
I really do the one thing that George didn't mention. 00:32:55
That we had discussed. Excuse me, miss callback if you could. 00:32:59
Take down the hearing assistance. I think it's creating some feedback. 00:33:03
Thank you anyway, that we did discuss is 2 things, and this is in the proposal, but for the benefit of the public as well. 00:33:08
We envisioned having some kind of a. 00:33:18
Kind of like a plexiglass, but it's some new kind of material that they use when you go into a bank. 00:33:21
You know those? 00:33:27
In order to keep it from vandals. 00:33:29
Unfortunately you wouldn't. Shouldn't have to worry about it, but you do, especially that close to the to the street, the other 00:33:31
thing George and I talked about, and neither is agreeable to this too. 00:33:36
Is. 00:33:42
When it was going to be in the other location, we were going to run the electricity so that it would be lit at night. It would be 00:33:44
awesome at night, but. 00:33:48
In the new location. 00:33:52
George suggested this and I don't think there's any reason why we couldn't do it. 00:33:54
Southwest, we'll talk about it if you want, but and that is to have it done by solar. 00:33:59
So if you have any questions, I'd be happy to answer, but I think the report's pretty comprehensive. 00:34:05
Yes. 00:34:11
I had one question Susan and I noticed in reading about it. 00:34:12
I'm just wanting to confirm that the. 00:34:17
Family would graciously cover. 00:34:21
The cost of construction and installation, would that also include the plaque that is requested? OK, that was my question. Thanks. 00:34:23
Anybody else? 00:34:33
Yes, hi. I have some questions. 00:34:35
So you're mentioning solar, Would this be a light? My my understanding is the panel is in front of bricks. Is that correct? 00:34:39
It looked to me like it is in front of. That was what it was designed for, the other location. 00:34:46
So I don't know exactly how it's going to be now. 00:34:51
You might ask that what? 00:34:54
About it because. 00:34:56
Since we put this in. 00:34:57
The location has changed. 00:34:59
So. 00:35:01
OK, I'm a little bit confused then I guess about location. 00:35:02
The location is across the driveway from where it was before. 00:35:07
Because there's first of all, there's two trees that would have to come out, and there's also a power pole. Missus. Welbeck, if 00:35:11
you could please talk into the microphone. I'm sorry. 00:35:15
Thank you. 00:35:20
When someone's talking to me, I have to go, yeah, there's a power pole in two trees. 00:35:21
That George and I talked about. So it'll be on the opposite side of the driveway. 00:35:27
Closer to City Hall, and it was. 00:35:31
Thought by Mr. Auga and the former city manager talked about it is that, you know, this is kind of our Civic Center here with the 00:35:33
City Hall, the Police Department, the fire department. 00:35:38
Community development, you know, it's the closest thing we have to the City Hall and you think about all the other cities and 00:35:44
nobody have anything as cool as this. They wouldn't. It's really cool. It's very valuable. 00:35:50
And NATO. 00:35:56
Doesn't really care about the. 00:35:58
You know, the city can have it forever, but he just doesn't want it to be. 00:36:01
So or put down under, be in the museum or something and not used. So I think it's a really exciting. 00:36:06
Day for the city of Pacific Grove to think that we would have such a thing in our butterfly town that we love so much. 00:36:14
So. 00:36:21
Thank you. 00:36:22
Commissioner Person, I've put back up the the shot that shows. 00:36:25
The the bricks that you were referring to, and you know those are part of the generator house that will, you know, stay right 00:36:29
where they are. And then the art piece that you see here with the bricks behind it is just the window that would be framed in some 00:36:35
sort of a clear protection. 00:36:40
And would be moved over to the right. 00:36:45
OK. So just one question on that, does that. 00:36:48
Bush stay there. 00:36:51
Is that a Bush right there? 00:36:53
Does that. 00:36:55
When he showed the Google map, there was OK. 00:36:57
OK. Thank you. I I missed that obviously. OK. 00:37:01
Thank you. 00:37:04
Good afternoon. My name is Safwat Malik. I'm the architect. 00:37:15
Representing the Alga family in this program. 00:37:19
The. 00:37:25
The reason we wanted to have the panel in front of the. 00:37:26
Of that. 00:37:32
Building. 00:37:34
Is to. 00:37:35
To give it protection. 00:37:37
From the backside. 00:37:39
As a backdrop. 00:37:42
Solid backdrop. 00:37:44
The tree can be moved. 00:37:46
Also, the tree is less than 6 inches in diameter, so. 00:37:49
However. 00:37:53
The Mr. Aga and his family do not mind wherever you want to put the panel. 00:37:55
There's also an error in presentation that. 00:38:02
The other family is. 00:38:06
Closing to donate the. 00:38:09
The. 00:38:11
Club Stained glass panel which is composed of three. 00:38:12
Three separate panels. 00:38:16
They will have a frame to hold them all together. 00:38:18
And the rest of the installations such as the podium where the. 00:38:22
The panel is going to go is up to the city to decide how they're going to do that. 00:38:26
Whether or not you wanna have a solar. 00:38:32
Energy or. 00:38:38
Electricity. Again, it's up to the city. 00:38:40
One benefit in keeping the the the glass panel. 00:38:45
In front of the the. I guess you call it generator building. 00:38:50
Is to have the solar panels on top of the generator building so they will not be obtrusive. They you will not be able to see them 00:38:54
so there are lots of benefits in having that. 00:39:00
That panel in front of the generator building. 00:39:07
However. 00:39:10
It's up to the city to determine that. 00:39:11
And I'm here to answer any questions you may have. 00:39:15
Think at this point we need some clarity on what. 00:39:20
It means that the Auger family will pay for the installation. So would the city responsible be responsible for paying for the 00:39:24
podium and the solar, or would the Auger family be footing the bill for that? 00:39:31
The the Alga family will assemble the three panels together and make them. 00:39:38
Ready for installation on A. 00:39:45
Podium that the city will. 00:39:48
Construct. 00:39:52
OK. 00:39:54
So at the In other words, they their involvement ends at donating the panels. 00:39:54
And assemble the three panels together such that they can fit on top of a platform of whatever. 00:40:01
Choice you want. 00:40:08
OK. 00:40:09
Thank you for that clarification. 00:40:10
Yeah. 00:40:14
No, he can't. I I believe you cannot give us an estimate of the cost because you don't know what it is the city would be 00:40:17
constructing. 00:40:20
So the city would have to. 00:40:23
Decide what they wanted, where they wanted it, and then provide the estimate to council. 00:40:28
Is George, thank you. You did a wonderful job on this presentation. I appreciate that. Would you be responsible for that for? 00:40:33
Getting those estimates together also. 00:40:42
Secretary Lee, I can't provide a really conclusive answer there. I think myself or other people in public works would be. 00:40:45
OK. But but we can do that, OK. 00:40:54
So that would be part of the package that went to City Council. 00:40:57
And then they would have the final decision on whether they wanted to spend the money. So we. 00:41:02
The, You know, I'm sure all of us love the idea right now, but it's in the idea phase we would need. 00:41:07
Monetary. 00:41:14
Estimates to no. And then there is another factor involved also and that's the liability to the city. 00:41:15
So if we are going with. 00:41:23
That the city would be. 00:41:26
Responsible for notifying the Auger family. 00:41:29
If something happened within that 10 year time frame, so let's say. 00:41:33
I can't imagine what would happen, but let's say something happened where the piece was going to have to be stored for a little 00:41:40
while. 00:41:43
Or maybe the Auger family wasn't pleased with how the city was maintaining it. Something. And so then we're giving it back to the 00:41:47
Alger family and they say, Oh no, it's in worse condition than when you got it. It's not OK, this is something that. 00:41:55
We cannot address as a board. It has to go through our city attorney. 00:42:04
The. 00:42:08
The Aga family would be. 00:42:09
I'm sure that the city will ensure it. 00:42:11
But in any event. 00:42:14
If something happened to, it had to be repaired. 00:42:16
Then either the insurance company would pay for it, or the city would pay for it. 00:42:19
But if it had to be repaired and it had to be stored for a short time. 00:42:23
Umm. 00:42:28
It wouldn't revert. We we could clarify that a little further I. 00:42:29
Yeah, and I understand that, but I'm just not qualified to talk with you about this. It has to go through the city attorney. I 00:42:32
think a lot of I mentioned that before that they would do that. I'm sure they'll do it at the City Council level. 00:42:39
Yes, yeah. Yeah. And so that'll give us time if we want to go forward. I mean, no, lunch is entirely free. 00:42:46
This is a very generous offer from the Aga family and I don't think there's any problem. I think we can work it out. 00:42:55
OK. 00:43:01
Are there any Commission? 00:43:04
Thank you so much. Are there any Commission? 00:43:06
Discussions. 00:43:08
Umm. 00:43:11
I think this is a a very generous offer and it's symbolic to our town. It's iconic, it's historic. I think that this is a a really 00:43:12
amazing offer and I would like to see this constructed and put. 00:43:19
Outside. 00:43:28
The in the location that is being agreed upon. So I like the not at the generator building for. 00:43:29
The vibrational issues and or. 00:43:36
Whatever that might cause. 00:43:40
I like it in the more open air idea with the solar panel for lighting. That would be really awesome and beautiful. 00:43:43
Umm. 00:43:51
Yeah, this is a beautiful idea. 00:43:53
And. 00:43:54
Commissioner Wilkinson, I'm sorry to interrupt you and Secretary Lee, if you wouldn't mind if we could open the floor for public 00:43:55
comment, of course, before we do. 00:43:58
Groups. 00:44:03
So let's go ahead and do public comment on this item. 00:44:07
It gives again real quick. I think it's a great idea. I remember seeing this. 00:44:16
Years ago when we used to go into Pacific Grove, I'm, I'm betting I don't know liability, but so many volunteers who do so much 00:44:20
great work here in Pacific Grove on the boardwalks and other things, I'm guessing that you could gather a group of volunteers to 00:44:25
construct a platform for this thing and put it together, minimize the cost. 00:44:31
I'd like to see it too. It's a great idea and. 00:44:37
I think most people would be for it. Thank you. 00:44:39
Shelly, I do agree with everyone. That's a wonderful idea. The only question I have is. 00:44:52
This is the right location. 00:44:57
And I think you know, and I don't really don't have anything against the location now, but if you really look at the. 00:44:59
Spectre and when it really sets, sits out here in Force Ave. 00:45:05
It's It probably wouldn't get the audience that it deserves. 00:45:10
We are reconfiguring the whole downtown there on Central Ave. with the construction across from the library. 00:45:14
There might be a more appropriate place there that it would be. 00:45:21
You know, it's a beauty, would be enjoyed and it would really add to the city. 00:45:25
So. 00:45:30
Ohh, I'd say is let's. 00:45:31
Put throw it out there and give people there might be some place we never thought of. 00:45:33
And there would be whole disparity. So thank you. 00:45:38
I I think it's a beautiful idea and a very generous move by the yoga family. 00:45:50
To have this opportunity to share the beauty of that. 00:45:57
Lovely stained glass that most of us who have been here for, you know, quite some time, remember going to the home and building 00:46:00
their shopping. 00:46:05
Looking at that, it was very pretty and it was a shame that it's gone, but. 00:46:09
I'm surprised that the architect of the new property there didn't work something out, but that's another story. OK, I love the 00:46:13
idea. 00:46:17
But it kind of makes me remember. 00:46:21
Past situations where collaboratives were done between a donor and the city. 00:46:25
And there were some negative surprises, heartbreaking surprises. For example, a family donated the little park on the corner of 00:46:31
17th St. 00:46:36
And Ocean View Blvd. right across from the. 00:46:41
Lovers point there on that corner, and it was supposed to be a park for perpetuity. 00:46:45
But then the city negotiated to build. 00:46:49
That low income senior housing unit. 00:46:52
Next to that park and they didn't have enough room for a parking lot. So guess what I was at the meeting when the then mayor said, 00:46:55
hey, parks need parking lots, so we're gonna build a parking lot, that parking lot that's there now next to the. 00:47:02
Low income housing units used to be part of the park. Grass, trees, bushes, and now it's a parking lot. And the city claimed that 00:47:10
that was warranted because the park needed the parking lot, but they were building the parking lot for the housing unit, not for 00:47:16
the park, and the park didn't need parking lot. Come on. 00:47:21
And they made a reference to Yosemite has parking lots and that's a park. And I thought that was a ridiculous excuse. Now, So what 00:47:27
I'm saying to Susan, being an attorney, is make sure you have this thing ironclad. 00:47:33
That sometime in the future after the 10 years are up, when it reverts to the city that some guy doesn't decide we're gonna sell 00:47:39
it for revenue like they did with the home and mansion. 00:47:43
Remember when the Holman family donated the Holman mansion to the city and the arts association and they were gonna share the 00:47:48
property? And then guess what? Ohh Gee, we don't have enough money to maintain it. 00:47:54
Let's sell the mansion. 00:48:00
And that took care of the perpetuity of the property. So there's another situation. And the final one was I was here at another 00:48:02
City Council meeting when the mayor and the council promised. 00:48:07
That the Low Income Housing unit next to Lovers Point was gonna be for Pacific Grove seniors. 00:48:13
Only. 00:48:20
And that didn't last long. Now it's open to anybody. 00:48:21
And so, you know, a lot of these promises by the city. Somehow the attorney figures out how. Don't worry about it. We'll fix that 00:48:25
later. So, Susan, please be careful what you negotiate with the city. Thank you so much. 00:48:30
Just wanted to thank the donors for their generosity. This is a wonderful work of art. It's beautiful, although I have no. 00:48:47
Problem with the proposed location. I think that's a great location I do want to echo. 00:48:56
Bob Celli sentiment that. 00:49:01
This really is a wonderful piece and could be a centerpiece of our community. So putting some extra thought into how we are 00:49:03
presenting that within Pacific Grove and how we're utilizing it. 00:49:08
Might be to the community's benefit. 00:49:14
Thank you very much. 00:49:16
Paul walking stick. 00:49:18
Of course. 00:49:21
OK. Can we go to? 00:49:28
Zoom people. 00:49:29
Yes, let's start with Inga, Lawrence and Dahmer. 00:49:31
Thank you. 00:49:35
Umm. 00:49:38
I think it's a wonderful piece of art. 00:49:39
I think it really needs. 00:49:43
Scrutiny with the legal aspects. 00:49:45
Definitely. 00:49:49
Because we know. 00:49:50
Litigation in this city and certainly between one of the the Donator here and. 00:49:52
Almost every entity, so the legal aspects really have to be scrutinized. 00:50:01
As far as location. 00:50:07
Certainly the city landscaping on the that side of the now proposed. 00:50:11
Uh. 00:50:17
Parking lot there. 00:50:17
Need some help so that would be a good location. 00:50:20
And certainly there's no problem with the bulletproof quote UN quote plexiglass covering something because. 00:50:23
I mean, goodness, we have that all throughout our City Hall now. 00:50:30
Just go up to the community development department or anything else and we're all surrounded by plexiglass. 00:50:34
Umm. 00:50:43
I think that Bob Pacelli was really great with suggesting that there might be a better showcase example. 00:50:45
Location for. 00:50:55
Putting this, although as I said, the landscaping around City Hall, it sure could help that a bit too so. 00:50:57
And by that parking lot. 00:51:06
I guess that's it. 00:51:13
Thank you very much. 00:51:14
Next we have Miss Lisa Gianni. 00:51:20
Thank you. I was wondering if BRC still has a public art? 00:51:23
Subcommittee. 00:51:30
I I don't know if it went dormant or went away. 00:51:31
Completely or I I don't know, but. 00:51:35
It seems like a time when. 00:51:38
A subcommittee. 00:51:41
Could go around with. 00:51:42
George. 00:51:44
And. 00:51:45
I I don't know other people would be interested because. 00:51:47
Because I I really love. 00:51:50
Bob Pacelli's. 00:51:52
Suggestion that there might be an even better location. 00:51:54
Umm. 00:51:59
So just to be able to go around and evaluate different situations. 00:52:00
And note. 00:52:07
The the different concerns about. 00:52:09
How? It's how it's being protected and lighted. 00:52:12
And and. 00:52:15
Just. 00:52:17
Where it where it would be best viewed and safest? 00:52:18
There's so many aspects to consider. 00:52:23
So that that's just my concern. 00:52:26
Concerns, but I I think it's absolutely marvelous that Mister Agha is. 00:52:30
Wants to donate this and and it's just. 00:52:39
Such a fitting. 00:52:42
Piece for. 00:52:44
PG. Thank you. 00:52:45
No further hands raised. 00:52:50
OK. Thank you. Now do we have any? 00:52:51
Commissioner discussion. 00:52:55
Umm. 00:53:02
Yeah, I have to say, I echo some of the concerns with hidden costs. I would advise attorney review. I don't know if it's gone 00:53:03
through any of that already. 00:53:08
And I also when I first saw this online. 00:53:15
I really thought that. 00:53:20
Also, it would be better showcased in a building. I thought it was beautiful in the whole main building. 00:53:23
I. 00:53:29
I don't know on the ground. I just. 00:53:31
It doesn't really do it justice. It's a beautiful piece. 00:53:33
I think in a very generous gift so. 00:53:37
I think I echo many people that I think it is a good idea to maybe consider another location. 00:53:40
I agree with everything Commissioner Person just said. 00:53:54
Umm. 00:53:57
When I considered location, I thought, wow, it needs to be where more people would see it. And then I realized if we put it at one 00:53:59
of the. 00:54:02
Intersections on Lighthouse by the trees. It might get hit by a car, so that was not a great idea and then I thought. 00:54:07
I agreed with what? 00:54:14
Miss Lawrence and Dahmer said that. 00:54:16
City Hall could really use this sprucing up, however now. 00:54:19
So how do we go about? 00:54:23
I mean, we can go about clarifying the hidden costs. 00:54:26
I mean, really we have to decide location before we can clarify the hidden costs, right? And then? 00:54:30
The attorney review would happen after those decisions were made. 00:54:36
So how do we go about clarifying? 00:54:40
Location. 00:54:43
Is anybody Would anybody like to volunteer to? 00:54:45
Look at this as a maybe single person subcommittee. 00:54:50
And we don't. 00:54:58
It's on hiatus. 00:54:59
Ohh no, we don't have that. That subcommittee is inactive, so. 00:55:01
Umm. 00:55:06
Do you want to Marty? 00:55:11
Please. 00:55:15
Yes, thank you. 00:55:15
OK. 00:55:18
Then I would like to make a motion that. 00:55:20
This item B moved forward. 00:55:24
By. 00:55:29
Commissioner Dunn working with. 00:55:30
Public Works and Miss Goldbeck. 00:55:33
If necessary to determine. 00:55:35
The best location for this? And then have it come back to the NRC. 00:55:38
We put the time limit on it. 00:55:46
Fast. 00:55:49
And and when it comes back to the BRC. 00:55:53
It will also come with a cost estimate associated with that. 00:55:58
And then I think it can be reviewed by the city attorney as it makes its way up to council so. 00:56:03
We don't need to include that part in the motion. 00:56:08
So the motion is that we recommend that. 00:56:13
Mr. Dunn work with the public works to determine the best location and. 00:56:17
That it come back to the NRC with that location recommendation and a cost analysis of. 00:56:22
How much it would cost to create the. 00:56:27
Structure needed. 00:56:30
To install it. 00:56:32
Secretary Lee, So fundamentally, fundamentally, you're recommending that this is not. 00:56:35
Recommended. 00:56:40
To be brought to City Council at this time. 00:56:41
Is that am I correct in that I can't control? 00:56:47
When the location. 00:56:52
Is decided upon, so I think it has to come back here. 00:56:54
Secretary, I would just ask that you make that part of whatever motion you make very clear. 00:57:00
Pertaining to the recommended action on the agenda. 00:57:05
Whether or not the BRC is recommending this. 00:57:08
To City Council or not recommending this to City Council? 00:57:11
Or am I allowed to recommend that it come back here? 00:57:15
I think you're welcome to recommend that, but that would be de facto not recommending it. Go to City Council at this point. I see. 00:57:20
OK then. 00:57:25
Oh. 00:57:32
Secretary, I think you could also continue this to another BE NRC mean meeting as well. 00:57:35
OK. Then that's what I'd like to do. I'd like to continue this item. I'd like to move to continue this item to our next B NRC 00:57:39
meeting. 00:57:43
And during that interim time frame, Commissioner Dunn, we'll meet with Public Works, determine a location and Public Works will 00:57:47
begin to make. 00:57:51
The cost estimate analysis. 00:57:57
A second. 00:58:08
And now I'll, I'll do a roll call vote, Commissioner, done. 00:58:11
Yes. 00:58:15
Commissioner walking stick. 00:58:16
Yes, Commissioner Brisson. 00:58:18
Yes, Secretary Lee. 00:58:20
Motion carries. 00:58:25
40 with two absent. 00:58:26
OK, so now we need to move on to item 7B, which is the. 00:58:52
Recommendation that the. 00:58:57
The NRC. 00:59:00
Volunteer 1 Commissioner to be on the joint working group with other city commissions and Secretary Lee Commission members. Just 00:59:04
to give a quick background to this is. 00:59:08
The brainchild of Police Chief Kathy Malone. 00:59:14
And I think she's aiming to just foster communication and cooperation between all the different boards and commissions. 00:59:17
And the idea is that. 00:59:23
After her helping to sort of set this up. 00:59:25
And establish some, you know, basic parameters. 00:59:29
It'll be a hands off thing in regard to city staff and Chief Matt alone and an individual volunteer from each boarding Commission 00:59:32
will take the lead from there and they will decide the. 00:59:38
Intervals at which they'll meet, and they'll kind of set the tone for where they want this working group to to head. 00:59:46
So the the ask right now is just to solicit a volunteer from each board. 00:59:53
Who would be willing to be part of this group? 00:59:59
And once you have someone selected, I'll be happy to put you in touch with Chief Malone and the rest of that group. 01:00:02
So does this need to go out to terminal public comment then? 01:00:08
Because it is an agenda item, I think that would be appropriate. 01:00:13
OK, so. 01:00:16
Are there any comments about this item? 01:00:17
Are there any comments? I see we have one hand raised online. 01:00:21
We were hands raised from Ingo Lawrence and Dahmer. 01:00:26
Thank you. 01:00:30
This has gone around to all the different subcommittees. It has never been explained. 01:00:32
The chief has not really come in and explained. 01:00:37
Nobody has jumped on board. The questions are. 01:00:41
Was this a brown act or could the public be there? Is it a zoom? You know, all these things? Well, obviously. 01:00:45
It was not ever envisioned as that. I'm not sure what the real thing is because there's no communication on the communication. 01:00:52
And I think that if the chief wants to foster this, she needs to explain it very much better than it has been and no Borden 01:01:02
Commission has jumped on it as such. 01:01:09
So and they've all asked For more information. 01:01:16
And I am. 01:01:20
Requesting that you do the same gets more information that's concrete. 01:01:21
And. 01:01:27
What it's really about? 01:01:29
Thank you very much. 01:01:31
From Paul walking stick. 01:01:41
Umm. 01:01:42
First of all, I would like to, yeah, Thanks Martin. First of all, I'd like to once again thank the people who put this together. 01:01:44
This is long overdue. 01:01:52
Seeing some communication and cooperation among the different committees so that we can have a coordinated effort across the city. 01:01:54
Is vitally needed. 01:02:00
And will be of tremendous benefit to our community. Inga brings up some good points that yes, this does need to be fleshed out. 01:02:01
This does need better exploration next and explanation. 01:02:07
However, this is the starting point. 01:02:15
We have nothing up to this point. 01:02:17
We have an absence of cooperation, we have an absence of communication. 01:02:19
With this directive, we actually begin taking the steps where we can actually communicate among the different committees. I'm all 01:02:23
for it, thank you very much. 01:02:26
Thank you. 01:02:31
Mike Gibbs with the EDC. I agree with Mr. Walking Step. I know a little bit about this it since I'm on the DC and I did talk to 01:02:40
Chief Madalone. They really it's an informal group. It's a non brown act. 01:02:46
Group and it's you know get together coffee have exchange of information between the. 01:02:52
Different boards and commissions. I mentioned that I think at the clean up is great idea. It's just a sharing of information. 01:02:57
There's so much going on. 01:03:02
That nobody can attend all of the boards and Commission meetings, the task force meetings. 01:03:06
And it's one person to say, hey, did you know that the CDC's working on a strategic plan? 01:03:11
For the business community in Pacific Grove, Ohh, well maybe you know, we should think about that when we're placing the stained 01:03:16
glass butterflies for example, or other issues that are going on. So I think it's a great idea. I'd like to see it go forward. 01:03:22
I. 01:03:29
You know, I I think it it you know it may not work out but more communication couldn't hurt. So I hope. I hope you all volunteer 01:03:30
somebody from the. 01:03:35
BRC volunteers for this great idea. Thank you. 01:03:39
Following I'm following two great communications that I really appreciate, the gentleman that just spoke, the two of them. 01:03:46
And I couldn't think. 01:03:54
Of a more profound and important function. 01:03:56
For a group like this, than what I mentioned earlier in the general oral communication we have a magnanimous. 01:03:59
Lee Negative situation with the state forcing us to cooperate with their building mandate for the 11150 new housing units. 01:04:06
And all of these different organizations. The reason I'm speaking to you is it affects some of your domain. 01:04:17
The parks. 01:04:24
We don't want the state forcing us to build housing in half or all of George Washington Park. The rec department, they play into 01:04:25
that. Should we take away the baseball field and build apartments there? 01:04:31
There's see all the, you're all integrated. 01:04:37
For the good of the community, for the good of the city, and you do a wonderful job and I appreciate the work you do. So I just 01:04:40
want to say again, I appreciate this and if you have a chance to look on your computer. 01:04:46
At a website called. 01:04:53
Are. 01:04:54
Ohh, you are our and you will see a really good explanation of what the state is forcing the city and 01:04:55
other municipalities to do unless the city comes up with something and if the people don't get involved and voice their 01:05:01
opposition. 01:05:07
I mean signal. A few people think this is the greatest thing. Let's flood the town with new housing units. 01:05:13
Yeah, we don't need parks. We don't need parking lots. Let's just build apartment buildings everywhere. OK. Thank you. 01:05:18
Great. Thank you all. 01:05:31
Is there a Commission discussion? 01:05:33
The volume question. 01:05:39
How many do you know, George? How many? 01:05:41
Individuals. This might comprise how many boards? You how many boards? Subcommittees. 01:05:45
I'm going to start over again. How many boards and. 01:05:51
Other groups? Does this involve what would be? 01:05:55
Say a maximum number per meeting. 01:05:58
Commissioner Dunn. 01:06:10
Looking at the City Pacific Grove website, it looks like it would be approximately 15. 01:06:12
OK. Would there. 01:06:17
And I realized that the group would convene at its its own cadence, to quote the. 01:06:19
Preface. 01:06:26
But if some groups we meet once a month, what if a group? 01:06:28
In this. 01:06:32
A committee meets every two months, or maybe quarterly. 01:06:35
Does that affect the? 01:06:39
Input. 01:06:43
Commissioner Dunn, I believe that this, the intention here is that this is a kind of an informal gathering of representatives from 01:06:44
each boarding Commission and the details have yet to be hammered out and the intent is for. 01:06:49
The the members, the volunteer members, representatives of these different boards and commissions as part of this group will. 01:06:54
Kind of decide that on their own. Alright, thank you. 01:07:01
I would just like to say I find this very exciting and I would like to volunteer if. 01:07:06
There is no one else. 01:07:11
I think this is a great idea for collaboration and communication, which is well needed within our boards. I, I I'm going to echo 01:07:15
Mike Gibbs and saying that. 01:07:20
We sit in on a lot of board member meetings a lot during the week. It would be really nice to have kind of an update and have one 01:07:27
of our board members from each board go together and meet and then come back and we can all kind of talk about it. I think that's. 01:07:35
Really fabulous. 01:07:43
I too would be interested in that position. But Rebecca, you. 01:07:45
Would be great in it too. 01:07:51
Any one of us really so. 01:07:53
OK, picking. And I wanna rock paper scissors or rock, paper, scissors. So yeah, I think we're all really excited about it, but I 01:07:56
mean to speak. 01:08:00
I really like the idea. I would actually love to see the police chief come in for a presentation and just. 01:08:08
You know for questions as well and any. 01:08:18
Umm. 01:08:21
Any confusion whatever can be. 01:08:23
Responded to answered. I'm also wondering if we should think about. 01:08:25
On our. 01:08:30
Committee, if there's a sensible pairing in terms of subcommittee. 01:08:32
Representative. 01:08:38
Kind of with overlap. 01:08:39
So, umm. 01:08:41
I would also consider doing this as well, but I really would. 01:08:43
Love to have a presentation. 01:08:47
Would it be possible that we alternate? 01:08:54
That not one person has to do each meeting that maybe we take turns. 01:08:58
It's also an interesting idea. That's why I think a presentation would be great. We could kind of. 01:09:06
Discuss this, but I think that's a good idea because then we all. 01:09:11
Contribute. 01:09:15
And we all got a sense of, so I actually think that's a good idea. And then we're connected. Each of us has some idea first hand 01:09:16
of what goes on at the meetings rather than getting a report that's a good idea. Would you like to continue this item and ask the 01:09:21
police chief to come to our next meeting? 01:09:27
Yes. 01:09:33
OK. So I'll move to continue this item to our next meeting. 01:09:35
And umm. 01:09:38
What do I say, recommend or direct staff to invite? 01:09:41
Commit. 01:09:44
Commander Malone to. 01:09:47
Invite. Invite her to come make a presentation for us. I'll just correct you there that it's Chief Malone. And do we have a 01:09:51
second? 01:09:54
2nd. 01:10:00
All in favor. 01:10:02
Aye. 01:10:03
Any opposed? 01:10:04
Motion is approved. 01:10:06
40 with two absent. 01:10:08
You have a presentation for Seven C George. 01:10:17
I do if you can give me one moment to pull it up. Thank you. 01:10:22
Commission members Item 7C is a revisit of the Monarch Sanctuary annual report. 01:10:48
So remember we discussed this. 01:10:54
And the report was presented at last month's meeting as well. 01:10:56
In order to add a little bit more information and some background, I'm going to go over just. 01:11:06
Kind of a very, very brief history of the monarch sanctuary. 01:11:10
It was really tempting to kind of go. 01:11:15
All out here and, you know, put together an hour or two long Monarch presentation. Thank you. 01:11:18
You know. 01:11:26
Personally, my background is in. 01:11:27
Geochemistry. 01:11:29
Renewable energy. 01:11:31
And environmental regulations, so. 01:11:32
I'm not. 01:11:34
Some world renowned bug guy or monarch expert. I've been doing this for about a year and a half with the city. 01:11:35
You know, primarily I think I got hired into this role because of my stormwater experience and my experience as a geologist. 01:11:43
And as much as I love working with you guys here in the NRC, I think my favorite thing is dealing with the Monarch Sanctuary. 01:11:51
So in the time that I've been here. 01:11:58
I've participated in the regional groups, the conferences, I've worked with the museum. 01:12:01
I've worked with the landscape volunteers. 01:12:06
With our volunteer coordinator Amy Colony here, we, you know, get in, get dirty with them, you know, once a month approximately 01:12:09
and you know, get involved. And also with the counters at the museum, the educational docents. 01:12:16
The visitor docents. 01:12:23
And all of the kind of regional monarch enthusiasts. So it is a big effort. 01:12:26
And. 01:12:32
I'm going to try my best to give kind of a focused history on what I think is most pertinent to. 01:12:33
Kind of the issues at hand right now. 01:12:39
And I'll start by kind of illustrating. 01:12:42
What you're looking at on the screen there? 01:12:45
That is former Mayor Flo Schaefer. 01:12:47
In 1992, cutting the ribbon. 01:12:50
On what is now the Monarch Growth Sanctuary. 01:12:53
The city purchased the the sanctuary. 01:12:57
To prevent it from being developed into houses. 01:13:00
And they raised. 01:13:04
$1.23 million of bond money in 1990. 01:13:06
That got an additional $200,000 from the state of California. 01:13:11
And. 01:13:15
Made a deal with the. 01:13:16
Former owner of the property, Edna Dively. 01:13:18
Who at the time owned the. 01:13:21
Hotel right there, adjacent. 01:13:22
And. 01:13:24
Where you currently have the row of three houses on Ridge Rd. and then the flag shaped. 01:13:25
Sanctuary property. 01:13:32
At the time, as you can see in 92 when the city acquired it. 01:13:35
It would look a lot different. 01:13:39
There you can see. 01:13:40
Brokaw Hall. 01:13:42
Which originally was built as part of the. 01:13:43
The Del Monte. 01:13:47
Organization that you know expansive land owners on the peninsula and it was used as a military hall and. 01:13:50
When? 01:13:58
From when the city purchased this property in 92 until that building was torn down in 2011. 01:13:59
It. 01:14:06
You know, fulfilled a number of different uses I remember as a kid going there. 01:14:06
To access stored library books. 01:14:10
And for different meetings and things. 01:14:13
But. 01:14:15
The management plans that we're talking about coincidentally. 01:14:18
Originated in 2011 when that building was torn down. 01:14:22
And in 2011, when that building was torn down, you can see. 01:14:26
Also the. 01:14:29
There was a driveway, so you could drive a truck, a big truck, if you wanted to. 01:14:31
All the way from the bottom there on on groove acre. 01:14:35
Up to Ridge Rd. 01:14:38
And you can see there's a lot of open space. 01:14:41
And from one, the city bought it in 92 to when they tore down. 01:14:44
Brokaw Hall. 01:14:48
There wasn't a lot of intensive management happening. 01:14:50
For better or worse. 01:14:53
But. 01:14:55
That that was clearly. 01:14:56
I need that you know that was there and the solution was to create this 2011 management plan. 01:14:59
And here's some more pictures showing kind of what used to be the Brokaw Hall on the left. 01:15:07
The demolished footprint of Brokaw Hall in the center. 01:15:13
And. 01:15:16
I think the following year. 01:15:18
The. 01:15:20
What they termed at the time? A hall of flowers. 01:15:21
Showing. 01:15:24
At the time I think it was 7 nectar beds, now we have 8. 01:15:25
And you can see how the path has been kind of refined into a meandering walkway. 01:15:28
Bordered by cobblestones that actually came from that chimney on the left there. 01:15:34
So. 01:15:40
What I'm really trying to get at is that. 01:15:41
The the sanctuary looks a lot different. And we're not talking about centuries ago, we're talking about. 01:15:43
Just. 01:15:49
A few decades ago, you know, this is 2011. 01:15:50
Not that long ago. 01:15:52
Working with the NRC. 01:15:58
The city. 01:16:00
Hired Dr. Stu Wise to create the 2011 Management Plan and it was adopted. 01:16:02
After a couple of years, it was apparent that updates were needed to the plan to kind of keep up with the times on what was the 01:16:08
kind of dynamic situation on the ground. 01:16:12
And from 2014 until now. 01:16:17
The city has. 01:16:20
Hired Dr. Stu Weiss and his team at Creekside Scientific to produce annual management updates. 01:16:21
As attached on this agenda item and reviewed at last month's meeting. 01:16:28
And kind of give an idea on how that works. 01:16:33
Every year city staff. 01:16:35
Works with and receives feedback, reports and opinions from. 01:16:37
All of the interested interested parties, landscape volunteers, museum volunteers and BRC members. 01:16:41
Doctor Weiss. 01:16:48
Visits the sanctuary a number of times. 01:16:50
He. 01:16:52
Works with myself, other staff. He works with the arborist and he also works with volunteers. 01:16:53
He solicits. 01:16:59
Any. 01:17:01
Notes. Any reports? 01:17:02
Any observations? 01:17:04
From volunteers and I've been part of that conversation with Doctor Weiss and the specifically the museum team. 01:17:06
That provides him with just a wealth of observational data. 01:17:12
From their weekly counts. 01:17:17
Really going tree by tree on where they see the butterflies and where they see the butterflies moving throughout the year. 01:17:20
So this isn't something that Doctor Weiss takes lightly. 01:17:25
I I, I think everybody involved. 01:17:32
With the monarch, sanctuary is. 01:17:35
Has the best of intentions and I think that. 01:17:37
Is true for Doctor Weiss. 01:17:39
Two. And I think there's regularly accusation staring at him that he's doing this for the money or he's. 01:17:42
You know, just he has kind of ulterior motives to destroy the trees. And I I just want to say my personal assessment is that is 01:17:48
completely not true. He is the most. 01:17:53
Through and through a bug guy, I know he loves these monarchs and. 01:17:58
Every recommendation that he is making is because he cares about this sanctuary and he cares about the monarchs. 01:18:01
That being said, his recommendations aren't final. They're refined by staff and they're prioritized. And that's kind of what you 01:18:09
saw at the last meeting a month ago. 01:18:13
Is. 01:18:18
Looking at Doctor Weiss's recommendations, Consulting with the arborist. 01:18:18
And consulting with other staff members and consulting with the volunteers. 01:18:22
They were kind of refined, refined down to and prioritize to what really needs to happen this offseason or this year. And that's 01:18:26
kind of what you guys saw. 01:18:30
Distilled down in the report and what City Council saw also. 01:18:35
And. 01:18:41
I completely agree with your the BRC feedback that it would be better to get the report earlier in the offseason and I'm going to 01:18:42
do everything I can. 01:18:45
Working with Doctor Weiss to make that happen so that we aren't kind of in this time crunch. 01:18:50
Because I agree that's an issue and I really hope that we can fix that next year. 01:18:54
Umm. 01:18:59
And but then I would just like to kind of make the point that. 01:19:00
Nothing in these plans is new. 01:19:04
Or groundbreaking. 01:19:06
It's largely been the same message and the same intent since 2011. Of course, small things change. Certain trees change certain. 01:19:08
Things on the ground change, but for the most part. 01:19:16
This shouldn't be new to anybody paying attention. 01:19:18
And it's also been pointing out, pointed out several times that the California Department of Fish and Wildlife. 01:19:22
Holds a conservation easement and like I showed in the previous slide. 01:19:27
The property was purchased in part with money from the state of California. 01:19:31
And as a stipulation of that $200,000 that the city used to purchase this property was. 01:19:35
To grant this easement to the. 01:19:40
State of California and to be honest, I think that was a great decision like. 01:19:42
You could look at it from the city's perspective. Oh, this is a headache. Oh, we've got to go through these layers. But I think if 01:19:48
anything. 01:19:50
You know, in 10 years, 20 years through 30 years, I don't know who's going to be doing this job and I think that that 01:19:53
conservation, easement existing kind of keeps the city honest and you know it it. 01:19:59
Also kind of creates this backdrop of OK, well if what if what if people want to add a bunch of signs or they add want to add a 01:20:06
bunch of benches or they want to add a gift shop? 01:20:10
It's an easy thing to say. 01:20:14
Not allowed. 01:20:16
Conservation easement. 01:20:17
Also. 01:20:19
It it has provided kind of a yearly review of these management. 01:20:20
Activities because every year this. 01:20:25
Management update is written by Doctor Weiss, received by the city and Excuse me. 01:20:27
It is submitted to the California Division, California Department of Fish and Wildlife and then they decide if it. 01:20:32
Those activities are in line with the conservation easement. 01:20:38
This year, and coincidentally you know, with the, I understand your complaints about. 01:20:42
Receiving the report later in the year than would be desired. 01:20:47
To add on to that, the representative of California deficient wildlife that we had had the same representative for. 01:20:50
Very long time, I believe, I think a decade or so retired. So we've got a new representative, a young young fellow. 01:20:58
And that added to this timeline also, because he didn't just look at this one update, he said. Hey, I'm brand new, send me all the 01:21:05
reports. 01:21:09
Send me everything you have. I'm going to meet with the guy that I'm replacing. 01:21:13
I'm going to go over this and it hasn't been as quick of a turnaround as past years. 01:21:17
But. 01:21:22
Since the BRC meeting. 01:21:23
The the the new representative of California Department of Fish and Wildlife. 01:21:25
Was at the public walkthrough. So he heard the public's opinions, heard the public's concerns. 01:21:30
He also met me individually at the sanctuary and one by one we walked to every single tree at issue here. 01:21:36
We talked about every the history of the park, the, the sanctuary we talked about. 01:21:43
Every little. 01:21:48
Activity that we're planning. 01:21:49
For the management. 01:21:51
And. 01:21:52
His assessment was that everything we're doing is in line with the conservation easement. 01:21:53
And I'm expecting an official letter from the California Department of Fish and Wildlife shortly to that tune. 01:21:58
So this year? 01:22:06
The Can I interrupt? 01:22:08
To ask a question. 01:22:11
Sure. 01:22:12
I have never read the conservation easement. 01:22:13
Can you summarize? 01:22:17
Like, does it have bullet points of parameters the report needs to meet or? 01:22:20
Is it possible for the conservation? You can understand the conservation easement does not. 01:22:27
Necessitate necessitate that this report is created. 01:22:32
The conservation easement. 01:22:36
Puts limits on what the city can do with the property. It prohibits any new development of the property. 01:22:38
And it prohibits any commercial use of the property. And it's it's definitely written in a sort of legalese. 01:22:43
But the gist of it from my reading is. 01:22:51
That. 01:22:54
Any infrastructure? Any signs? 01:22:55
And any kind of footpaths. 01:22:58
Can only be built to what they are their current state. 01:23:01
And so things can be replaced, but things can't be added. 01:23:05
So like for example in 2017 when the city added the the current bathroom. 01:23:09
The California Department of Fish and Wildlife considered that. 01:23:15
In line with the conservation easement, because we also demolished an old little kiosk that had porta potties. 01:23:19
So that. 01:23:25
Infrastructure installation was allowed because it was replacing a current installation infrastructure that was removed. 01:23:27
And what does it say about tree trimming? Does it just say entries will be trimmed? 01:23:33
Public safety or. 01:23:39
I think I'd have to. I I can. I'm happy to send you a copy of the Conservation of that. Thank you. 01:23:41
To to all of us. 01:23:46
And my recollection is that it, it just says. 01:23:48
You know. 01:23:51
First off that this is for the betterment of the butterflies, but also in line with. 01:23:52
Visitor safety and fire risk. 01:23:58
OK, and that's very much just my kind of reading of it. I'm happy to send you the exact text. Like I said, it's a little bit of 01:24:00
legalese, but I'm happy to send it to the whole BRC group. 01:24:05
A copy of the conservation. I think that would be wise to send it to us, but I but I get what you're saying and thank you for 01:24:10
that. 01:24:13
So this year? 01:24:20
The management update was presented to the NRC on August 15th. We just missed the timeline to get it on the agenda for the July 01:24:21
meeting unfortunately, which I believe was cancelled, but. 01:24:26
Umm. 01:24:32
The public walk through occurred with Doctor Stuart Weiss, our city arborist staff. 01:24:33
And a group of about 30 people. 01:24:38
With. 01:24:41
Commissioner Brisson in attendance as well, so thank you for that and also while I'm on that topic, thank you Commissioner Bryson, 01:24:43
for your. 01:24:46
Kind of engagement on this issue. It was great to see you at the. 01:24:50
Pollinator Workshop at the Museum and I appreciate everything that you've put into this. 01:24:54
And then? 01:24:59
After that public walk through, it was brought and just presented. No, it was put on the agenda for City Council to receive. 01:25:00
And at that City Council meeting, the BRC Tree and Sub Landscape Subcommittee communicated to council the desire to receive the 01:25:09
report earlier in the offseason. 01:25:13
Which I'm really hoping we can do next year, but then also to have kind of a further opportunity to provide feedback and 01:25:17
recommendations. 01:25:21
And I think that there's kind of an evolution to a lot of these things with boards and committees and even with council, where at 01:25:24
first it's like, hey, what is, you know, city staff doing, you know, we'd love to find out more. And then city staff says, well, 01:25:29
yeah, why don't we put together a report and we'll present it and then a boarding Commission might think, ohh, great, I'll, we'll 01:25:35
receive their support. And how will we receive this report annually? 01:25:40
And then as the years go on and you receive the report annually, you know, the NRC might think, hey, we don't want to just receive 01:25:46
this report, we also want to. 01:25:49
You know, have some input. We want to give feedback, We want to give recommendations. So I think City Council heard that sentiment 01:25:53
and directed staff to bring this back to you and that's what we're doing today. 01:25:58
To get further feedback and recommendations so. 01:26:03
To focus on kind of the three big things that I think are really important. 01:26:10
To do now. 01:26:15
Outlined here. 01:26:17
And and and this is just a quick outline I'm going to follow with pictures on each one of these items. 01:26:19
Number one, manage the large down tree. 01:26:24
A ginormous pine tree fell this last winter. It took out several. 01:26:27
Medium sized. 01:26:32
Trees in its path. 01:26:34
And. 01:26:36
The crown of dead wood is currently a big ball of Tinder. 01:26:37
And. 01:26:42
The recommendation is to buck it up or cut it into smaller pieces. 01:26:44
Mostly distribute the crown part of it. 01:26:48
And to leave the. 01:26:51
Trunk. 01:26:53
In place, but instead of hanging over the ground. 01:26:54
Drop it down onto the ground to decompose. 01:26:58
And again, I'm going to go into all these in detail with photos, but. 01:27:03
The second major recommendation is to remove the box eucalyptus trees from their current locations along the southeast fence. 01:27:06
And to. 01:27:12
Further within a group of Monterey Cypress trees. 01:27:13
They were planted in the mid 2000s in the northwest corner. 01:27:16
So, so first of all go to. 01:27:19
Here is a picture and I said this last month. I'm going to say it again. 01:27:22
These pictures do not do justice. 01:27:26
Umm. 01:27:28
Seeing how big that tree is in person is. 01:27:30
Kind of, you know. 01:27:34
Much more illustrative than a picture could be, especially once it gets shrunken onto a PowerPoint and then shrunken on these 01:27:37
little screens. So. 01:27:41
I really encourage everyone who's interested in this to go look for yourself. I'm happy to meet anybody on the Commission and 01:27:44
really anybody in the public. 01:27:48
And talk about this. 01:27:52
On the ground and really give you an idea on what we're dealing with here. 01:27:54
But if you you can see the root ball. 01:27:58
And if there was a person standing there, they wouldn't come anywhere near the top of that. 01:28:01
And then the second picture is looking. 01:28:05
From standing right there at the root ball. 01:28:08
Up the trunk of that tree. 01:28:10
And you can kind of see in the distance there the big crown of dead. 01:28:12
Branches. 01:28:17
And then on the right that medium, that trunk right there was a tree that just got. 01:28:18
Knocked right down as the tree fell. 01:28:24
I think for. 01:28:29
Fire danger that. 01:28:30
Fire danger alone. This is something that needs to happen. 01:28:32
And I also think it's important to distribute these fallen trees, especially their pine cones. So the intention is to. 01:28:35
You know, buck up the branches. 01:28:42
Find every pine cone we can and spread them out around the sanctuary. 01:28:43
And then when it gets hot over the summer, hopefully those pine cones will create some volunteers and you know, we'll keep the 01:28:47
cycle going with more trees. 01:28:51
So this is an item that I think should not wait and should happen. 01:28:56
Before the monarchs arrive sometime in October. 01:29:00
Hopefully. 01:29:03
The next item, removal of box eclipses trees. And I know that we've had some public comment. 01:29:05
And some emails to the group that are posted with the agenda to this effect. 01:29:11
But. 01:29:17
Just want a few things to clarify. 01:29:17
That. 01:29:20
It was very clear when these trees were donated and brought in. 01:29:21
Bye. 01:29:25
Mr. Bob Pacelli. 01:29:26
It was very clear that the box trees. 01:29:27
Being placed in the sanctuary was a temporary measure. 01:29:29
And. 01:29:33
This admittedly this was before my time, but I've I've read some of these emails. 01:29:34
And to me it's apparent that this was a temporary fix. 01:29:38
Just by the very fact that they're in boxes. 01:29:41
And speaking to Mr. Pacelli, he still considers these trees his property and has indicated wanting them back for other potential 01:29:45
sites if they are not going to be planted at the sanctuary. 01:29:49
The Redwood boxes are deteriorating with roots and soil coming through. 01:29:55
And we've heard you know comment at the walkthrough and at these meetings that. 01:30:00
You know eucalyptus trees don't root through boxes, that they grow in a globular form and that Redwood boxes will last forever. 01:30:05
And that's just not true. And I'm going to show you pictures to that effect. 01:30:10
If the trees are left to root in place. 01:30:16
At the fence line and above the ground. 01:30:18
They're still going to have to be removed eventually. 01:30:21
And postponing or their removal. 01:30:24
Just creates the a threat to the tree's health and survivability if we let these trees root into the ground. 01:30:27
And then we try and remove them. 01:30:33
It's going to kill the trees. 01:30:35
Here's the picture of the trees in question. On the left we have the 10 boxed blue gum eucalyptus trees. 01:30:39
And you can see. 01:30:46
The relatively thin trunks. 01:30:48
Going in different directions. 01:30:51
On the right here we have one of the trunks that was bound by twine. 01:30:53
And I didn't take pictures of every instance, but the trees are not in great shape. 01:30:57
That several of them have extensive. 01:31:01
Bark damage. 01:31:03
Several, several of them have been neglected. 01:31:06
And it. 01:31:09
Again, pictures only go so far here. I've tried my best to kind of show the foliage that we're dealing with. 01:31:11
So. 01:31:17
But it it's tricky because we have you have the towering eucalyptus row. 01:31:18
Kind of overhanging where I'm taking this picture so you can kind of take it. See on the left here where you have. 01:31:22
The big trees in the background and then. 01:31:28
Just you can see the the larger Leafs of the smaller tree that's in the box. 01:31:32
And you can see it's. 01:31:36
And I'm not. I'm not trying to, you know, disrespect the trees, but they're all spindly. 01:31:38
And you can see on the right here. 01:31:43
You know you have empty branches. 01:31:45
And if you look down the fence line, in general the trees are growing over the fence, seeking the sun. 01:31:49
As above them, these big towering eucalyptus trees. 01:31:55
Are competing for that same sum. 01:31:59
And they're they're not competing for water now because they're in boxes and they're all being hand watered. 01:32:02
But. 01:32:07
If they root into the ground, they will be competing with these large trees for sun and water. 01:32:08
And here's a picture you can see. 01:32:14
The soil coming out the bottom of the boxes. There's no floor to this box. It's completely disintegrated. You can see the pearlite 01:32:16
from the soil going onto the. 01:32:20
Sanctuary ground. 01:32:25
And you can see the roots coming through. 01:32:26
It took some effort to tip this tree up because those roots were in the ground and had to get pulled up out of the ground. 01:32:29
So if nothing happens. 01:32:34
These trees are going to root. 01:32:37
And the base of the tree isn't going to be in the ground, it's going to be two feet off the ground. 01:32:39
So. 01:32:44
What? 01:32:45
You know, yeah, we should do what's best for the monarchs. We should do what's best for the sanctuary. But we should also be 01:32:46
considering what's best for these trees and I think leaving them to root in place along this fence line where they're eventually 01:32:49
going to be removed. 01:32:53
Is irresponsible. 01:32:57
The next item The thinning of the Cypress saplings in north in the northwest corner. 01:33:02
This one hasn't gotten as much attention. I don't think it. 01:33:06
You know, I think anyone that's looked at these trees. 01:33:10
You can see that they're suffering. 01:33:13
There they were planted with the intention that. 01:33:16
You know, I think it was maybe a dozen of them or 10 or so were planted. 01:33:19
With the intention that they would be given 5-10 years to grow. 01:33:23
And then they would be thinned out, allowing the the strongest. 01:33:27
To grow into upper canopy. 01:33:31
Medium and upper canopy. 01:33:34
And if we don't do this? 01:33:35
Then they're going to just compete for resources. They're going to compete for the sun, compete for water and compete for 01:33:38
nutrients. 01:33:40
And we are depriving the future sanctuary of upper canopy trees by leaving these trees to compete. 01:33:43
The intent, The recommendation is to thin two to three of the weakest trees in this group. 01:33:51
2 trees were thinned. 01:33:57
Last year. 01:33:58
And. 01:34:02
Again, pictures don't do a great job, but. 01:34:03
I want you to you know these are. 01:34:05
You can see on the right here. 01:34:07
Kind of the I can count 12345. 01:34:09
Five or so trunks right there. 01:34:13
And then on the left it's, I think it's just. 01:34:15
The camera angle to the left of what you're looking at on the right there. 01:34:18
On it and it's It is hard to tell but. 01:34:22
Those lower branches are dried out and the trees are not flourishing. 01:34:24
They're starting to overlap each other. 01:34:29
And if we want these trees to grow into Hardy overhanging? 01:34:32
Upper canopy trees. 01:34:38
I think this is a necessity. 01:34:40
And I don't think there's any reason to wait. 01:34:41
Managing the sanctuary is a balancing act in a lot of ways. 01:34:46
You know, from the city's perspective, we have to balance. 01:34:50
You know, the top priority being the monarchs, but we also have to consider fire danger. 01:34:54
We have to consider. 01:34:58
Safety of visitors, Safety of neighbours. 01:35:00
But I think the biggest balancing act is managing the short term goals with long term goals. 01:35:04
And sometimes those are in conflict. 01:35:10
We might have a tree. 01:35:13
That the butterflies loved last year. 01:35:15
And there might be pictures of. 01:35:17
Just swarms of butterflies on this one given tree. 01:35:19
And maybe removing that tree. 01:35:23
Is going to have a small detriment to the butterflies next year. 01:35:26
But we need to think big. We need to think in five years, 10 years. 01:35:30
50 years. 01:35:35
What is best for the sanctuary long term? 01:35:37
And I think if you look at the history of the sanctuary, there's been a couple kind of catastrophic events. 01:35:39
That have swayed the balance. 01:35:45
Towards. 01:35:47
Short term solutions. 01:35:48
And have obscured some of these long term solutions. 01:35:50
And two of those things that I want to mention are that. 01:35:53
You know the tree fall there. A branch fell and. 01:35:56
Killed a woman in 2004. 01:35:59
And I think that that created this urgency to do short term actions. 01:36:02
That. 01:36:07
We're perhaps at the detriment of long term. 01:36:08
Goals. 01:36:10
And then I also think that abysmal monarch counts of 2000. Just a few years ago, we didn't have a single clustering monarch in the 01:36:11
sanctuary. 01:36:15
And I think that it's easy to look at a horrible situation like that and think we need to. 01:36:21
Do whatever we can for next year. 01:36:26
But. 01:36:30
Now we need to take a step back and think what are we doing not just for next year. 01:36:30
But for. 01:36:35
The future 10 years, 20 years, 50 years. 01:36:36
And it's imperative that the monarch sanctuary is managed for the future. 01:36:40
This sanctuary is important to Pacific Grove. 01:36:47
And we've got Monarchs on our logo. 01:36:51
We've got. 01:36:54
Every one of our school kids, you know, goes through the, you know, dresses up as a monarch. I don't have to explain how important 01:36:55
this is to Pacific growth, but this place is important. 01:36:59
To the state, it's, you know, monarchs. 01:37:04
It's important to the country, it's important to the whole world. 01:37:07
You know monarchs. 01:37:10
Are this incredible bug. 01:37:12
That kind of unites the world. 01:37:15
Where they migrate, migrate up and down the east eastern seaboard to Mexico, they migrate up and down. 01:37:17
The California coast. 01:37:23
And. 01:37:24
Of these overwintering sites in California. 01:37:26
We have a really special one. 01:37:28
Almost all of the overwintering locations are. 01:37:30
Entirely eucalyptus. 01:37:33
A non-native tree. 01:37:36
We are one of only two. 01:37:39
Prominent overwintering sites where they mostly overwinter on native trees, the Monterey cypresses and the coast live oaks. 01:37:41
There's we don't have them here, but there are some Sycamore trees that are native that they. 01:37:48
Overwinter on. 01:37:53
There are places right now that are really struggling because of that monoculture of eucalyptus trees. 01:37:54
Santa Barbara, for example, has a State Park where. 01:38:01
Whole swaths of eucalyptus trees in a State Park of a former formerly kind of premier overwintering site. 01:38:04
Suffered from three years of drought and. 01:38:11
Just toppled. 01:38:14
And. 01:38:15
Whole groups got together and say hey, how do we restore this overwintering site in Santa Barbara? And they said, well first we 01:38:17
need to restore these trees, let's plant some eucalyptus trees and it turns out that the State Park had signed a like a pact or 01:38:22
I'm out of my wording wrong but they had committed to not planning non-native trees. 01:38:28
So their hands were tied. They can't plant eucalyptus trees because they've signed an accord that they won't plant non-native 01:38:33
trees. So then they said, OK, well what native trees can we plant here? 01:38:38
That the monarchs. 01:38:44
Will overwinter on and there aren't any. 01:38:45
These native trees, the Pines. 01:38:48
The sycamores and the cypresses. 01:38:50
Aren't native South of about. You know San Luis Obispo. 01:38:53
So all of these overwintering sites in. 01:38:57
That Southern California are entirely dependent on eucalyptus trees. The eucalyptus trees are not withstanding these droughts 01:38:59
associated with climate change well. 01:39:03
And then there's also when you have a monoculture, there's the potential of. 01:39:08
Diseases so Albany Hill up on in the East Bay has suffered. 01:39:12
Blight of their eucalyptus trees, and they've had large numbers of their eucalyptus trees. Eucalyptus trees die from blight. 01:39:18
If this is going to happen to the eucalyptus trees up and down the coast, it's even more important to have overwintering sites 01:39:26
that feature native trees that aren't. 01:39:31
Susceptible to eucalyptus blight that aren't susceptible to the water requirements of eucalyptus trees. 01:39:36
This is a really special place. 01:39:43
Well. 01:39:47
With that, I will open it up to questions and I hope that you guys will recommend that the city. 01:39:49
Carries out these recommended actions that I've highlighted, and we do them promptly before the Monarchs arrive in October. Thank 01:39:56
you. 01:39:59
I don't have any questions. Anybody else? Go ahead. 01:40:04
And perhaps we could open it to public comment before questions. 01:40:08
All right. 01:40:12
Who would like to come speak? 01:40:13
Paul walking stick. 01:40:17
I know we're gonna have a little joke there. 01:40:19
On the first two points of the, excuse me, the first two urgent points that you you addressed. 01:40:24
I actually am in support of those, but on the Third Point of the thinning, although I'm not against the thinning them itself. 01:40:31
You had mentioned that you didn't think there was any reason to wait and and the reason that I would bring up. 01:40:40
Is uh? 01:40:45
When you remove a tree, you do remove the competition for resources from the community of trees. However, they have an 01:40:48
interdependency. They rely on one another. 01:40:54
For a while after you remove a tree, you compromise the others. They the common thing people see is you remove a first tree and 01:41:00
then the other trees near it get blown down because it was. 01:41:06
Providing a wind barrier, but there there's also a a mutual support system in the root system. 01:41:12
So when you remove one. 01:41:18
For a while, for a moment, you weaken the surrounding trees and we're going into. 01:41:20
With only know what's probably going to be a really, really hard winter. 01:41:25
I'm not against thinning. 01:41:29
I'm I'm about waiting for the thinning until we get through this butterfly season. We're already having butterflies show up in the 01:41:31
park as of today. 01:41:35
So I would just tap the brakes on that that one issue. 01:41:40
Also, I'm sure there's no ill intent in in the report. I never read it that way and I'm happy there's multilateral communication 01:41:46
happening. 01:41:49
It was indicated that through Doctor Weiss, the volunteers have informed this report. 01:41:53
We have a number of volunteers here today and I would like them to comment here. 01:41:58
On what portion of the the report that they contributed? 01:42:03
Thank you very much. 01:42:05
No, thank you. 01:42:19
I'd like to address. 01:42:20
First, comments to you. 01:42:21
The chili. 01:42:26
Umm. 01:42:28
I thank you for your work, and the irony of this whole thing is that. 01:42:29
A month ago, George came up with a. 01:42:34
Before this all started and he spoke to me about what his perceptions and plans were. 01:42:37
And they were pretty right on. 01:42:44
And I was overjoyed. 01:42:45
They weren't Doctor Weiss's plans. I felt he was a young man who had moved here. 01:42:48
And actually was telling the truth. 01:42:52
After spending a year looking at this. 01:42:55
I've since been dashed into depression. 01:42:58
But. 01:43:02
And the first point. 01:43:03
Zach over at Fish and Wildlife. I spoke with him. 01:43:05
Yesterday. 01:43:10
And no, he didn't approve anything. 01:43:12
And now he's not going to approve anything he put kicked it upstairs. 01:43:14
And he actually asked me to send him some more information. 01:43:19
Because the information he'd gotten here. 01:43:23
Well, let's just not say it wasn't very clear. 01:43:26
Are very consistent with something that would save the monarchs. 01:43:29
But the most disturbing part about this whole thing is. 01:43:35
We're rushing to cut down trees that they even acknowledge. 01:43:39
They have monarchs on. 01:43:44
For the future 50 year growth life. 01:43:46
Of the trees. 01:43:50
Which is the death of the monarchs. 01:43:51
So I could go on and on and even though my name's been mentioned and curly. 01:43:54
I've been involved for these last 30 years, but I only get 3 minutes. 01:43:59
So what I'd like to say is. 01:44:05
Let's sit back and wait. 01:44:07
It hasn't been approved by anybody. 01:44:09
And stir to ISIS plans which are totally consistent. 01:44:12
If we really had a staff that was working for us. 01:44:16
They would see, look up that those plants, those plants have been rejected by Fish and Wildlife. 01:44:20
All over and over again. 01:44:26
And they come back. This is documented. 01:44:29
This isn't fantasy. 01:44:31
This isn't somebody talking behind somebody's back. 01:44:33
So the paperworks there. 01:44:37
The realities there, but if we go forward with these plans? 01:44:39
We've only destroy the Sanctuary. 01:44:43
And we have an opportunity to sit back. 01:44:46
And come to. 01:44:49
Say spring. 01:44:51
And have a real open, and I don't know one volunteer who had any input. 01:44:53
That ended up in any of these plants. 01:44:59
And in fact, we're shut off. 01:45:02
And shut down. 01:45:04
But if you think about it, if we're standing here. 01:45:06
And we save one tree. 01:45:09
And two monarchs get together and mate. 01:45:12
And fly off. 01:45:15
She'll lay 3 to 400 eggs and that'll be repeated three more times. 01:45:16
So hope springs eternal. 01:45:21
But so stand here and say. 01:45:24
We have to cut these trees down. Even though you have pictures of monarchs on them, there's probably a new low. 01:45:26
Not only for us, but for humanity. 01:45:33
Thank you. 01:45:35
Anybody else? 01:45:47
Right. 01:45:58
And also state your name. 01:46:00
I hit this. 01:46:08
Are you guys at this? 01:46:09
OK, OK. 01:46:12
OK, my name is Heidi Trinkle. I'm here. 01:46:14
I'm in and out of Pacific Grove very often, but I'm currently a resident and I've been very fortunate to have volunteer. 01:46:17
And experience with experienced gardeners. 01:46:25
Karen Lock and setting the PG Community Garden. 01:46:28
And France is great in planting the original Nectar beds. 01:46:31
Umm. 01:46:35
For the sanctuary, for the. 01:46:36
With the Monarchs due to arrive as soon as three. Excuse me, ma'am, could you lower the microphone a little closer to your face? 01:46:38
Thank you. 01:46:41
With monarchs due to arrive as soon as three or four weeks from now, I hope the city refrains from cutting the canopy. That's as 01:46:45
it exists now. 01:46:49
The space by its name is the home for the monarchs, I feel. 01:46:54
We all want the numbers of Monarchs butterflies to continue to grow. 01:46:58
It seems ill timed and not prudent to do the cutting of the home where the monarchs will soon be resting, feeding and need to be 01:47:02
protected from the winds. 01:47:06
Also, I've walked through there and currently the deer and their baby. 01:47:11
They're underneath the different brush and they're eating and nibbling off the different plants. 01:47:16
Also the University of Wisconsin at Madison. 01:47:22
Between 28 July to 6th August. 01:47:26
They did their 7th annual International Monarch Monitoring blitz. 01:47:28
And invited community scientists from around North America to collect data on monarch butterflies. 01:47:32
They just released the data and. 01:47:38
The monarchs already moving. 01:47:40
They're already on on their way up here. They have noticed that they're at least 1500 adult. 01:47:42
Monarchs which is. 01:47:48
Crazy great for us. 01:47:49
But it means that if you cut anything down. 01:47:51
Umm. 01:47:54
And you just do it Willy nilly. 01:47:55